Biography
The following interview on Monday, November 11, 2002 is with Tracey Crawford who attended Baylor University, currently working as the president of Ramey & Flock, as well as the U.S. District Court for the Eastern District of Texas. The interviewer is Mat L. Everett.
ME is Mat L. Everett
TC is Tracey Crawford
Transcript
Attorney (hand written on interview cover page).
ME: What is your name?
TC: I am Tracy Crawford.
ME: Where do you currently reside?
TC: Forty-Forty Copland Road in Tyler.
ME: How long have you lived there?
TC: Twenty-two Years. No, Thirty-two years. Since 1970.
ME: Discuss your educational background.
TC: I have a B.A. from Baylor University and a Doctor Jurisprudence from Baylor Law School.
ME: What is your present position and how long have you held this posts?
TC: I am currently the president of Ramey & Flock, which is a professional corporation, a law firm. Honestly, I could not tell you how long. Probably, ten, fifteen years.
ME: How Long did you work with the U.S. District Court for the Eastern District of Texas?
TC: Well, I probably tried my first case there in 1963 or possibly 1964 in front of Judge Sheehe.
ME: Can you discuss changes in the court during your tenure?
TC: Well, certainly the courts are much larger now than it was in terms of the number of judges that are full-time magistrates. The practice before the courts, I think has also change significantly during the time period. I have never been involved in the criminal practice but accept on the rare occasions by appointment. In the early days there were workers' compensations cases that were occasionally tried in federal courts. Damage suit cases of one kind of another and then over the years publics liability became a very significant part of the practice before the courts. Then probably in the early to mid-seventies one of the very first asbestos cases in the country I think was brought before this court and to the best of knowledge it was one of the very earliest, if not the easiest of a case of that kind that involved a large number of defendants and a large number of plaintiffs making the same claim. I was not actively involved in that case, Jack Flock in our office was lead counsel for some of the main defendants in the case and I think Tom Henson was involved in some of that. In recent years the court has become more involved in very large commercial cases that have brought in the Marshall division and some in Tyler, but for the most part in Marshall or Texarkana.
ME: Can you discuss the public perception of the U.S. District Court for the Eastern District of Texas?
TC: I think there is probably two different perceptions, I think in public generally the perception is that the court is held in high esteem and the position the United States district Judge is highly regarded. In the legal community the same could be said of the judges. The judges are all held in very high regard as individuals and judges, but because of jury verdicts that have been handed down in either Beaumont or Marshall and Texarkana there is a very, very strong to inclination for people, if they are able to do so, bring their lawsuits in front of the one divisions of the district because of they believe it is more [intelligible].
ME: What was Judge Parker like?
TC: Judge Parker in on the cutting edge in everything he is involved in and very highly regarded among all the lawyers. He innovated in the terms of procedural matters and issues regarding administration of justice. I considered him a close personal friend and I respect him. As a trial judge he was fair. He ran a good court. He let the lawyers try their case, but on some occasion if he had some strong feelings about a case, he might ask a question or two. I think, overall all of the trial lawyers who had the opportunity to appear in his court thought he was a very good judge.
TC: Judge Parker and I have been friends since the very earliest days of our practice, I think because we are about the same age and we share some common roots in that in those days the state courts set their dockets, they would set periodic docket calls the lawyers and law firms around would journey to wherever the courts were located and would be present to hear the courts to call its docket and being able to respond on the behalf of the cases that were being handled by that lawyer's firm. So we would all sit around and drink coffee and a few years later Judge Ward became a part of that group and we developed close relationships. There were for both Judge Parker and Judge Ward there were more time when we were representing co-defendants in cases than cases against each other. I don't recall a single case that Judge Parker and I were on opposite sides. There may have been a case or two that I was against Judge Ward on an occasion, but that was rare. It was a just a certainly on my part a feeling of admiration and respect and collegiality.
ME: What judges have been influential to you and how?
TC: Probably the most important events in my career happened when I was a young lawyer, probably just out of law school, maybe a year; Judge Shehee on called me over to try a federal criminal case in his court. I don't even remember exactly the charge, but I believe it had to do with embezzlement of a bank. It seems to me like the bank might have been in Corsicana. It was something to do with Corsicana, but I didn't anything about criminal law or federal procedure and I was scared to death. Judge Sheehe would strike fear in the hearts of anybody. A federal judge has a lot more latitude than state court does. I stumbled through that trial with the help of Judge Sheehe; he gave me a lot of help. I don't even remember the outcome. I think the guy was convicted but I don't think the sentence was very strong or maybe he was convicted for a lesser charge. I had a sense of some degree of some success in the case but not a lot. After the case was over, Judge Sheehe called Judge Tom Ramey Sr. and said some kind words about me to Judge Ramey. I think it boosted my standing with Judge Ramey and more than anything it gave me a tremendous degree of confidence in the fact I could be a trial lawyer some day. Other than that Judge Stieger has been a judge that I have tried of cases before and I always Judge Stieger a very good friend and because of the manner in which he treated lawyers in his court, he gave me confidence in my abilities. Judge Justice is a judge that I probably tried the most cases in front of him than anybody else. Of course, Judge Justice is probably most widely known for this concern with the civil rights movement and all the time I was before him I was representing cases that claimed civil right violations or constitutional rights. But although that was true, Judge Justice always gave me a fair trial. I respected him as a man and I liked him very much as a person. I was in difficult straits in some cases before him but it was always handled in a very professional judicial temperament and I respected him for that.
ME: What cases have been influential?
TC: Well, I tried a case in Judge Justice's court in the early days of the civil rights movement. The plaintiff's lawyer was a civil rights lawyer by the name of Mark MacDonald out of Houston and later his wife was appointed to a federal judge. Mark was a very good lawyer and a very able advocate. He was representing a black school teacher form Lufkin and it was a lawsuit against the Lufkin Independent School District because claims of the termination of the teacher was motivated by discrimination. We tried that case in front of Judge Justice and there was a book about Judge Justice's career and in that book he said that it was the most difficult case he had to decide. He ruled in favor of the school district. It was a fairly long trial and it was widely observed by the people over in the Eastern District of Texas and the fact that we won the case it was not because of my doing, it was because we have some good facts. It also came to the attention to a lot of folks and I have a lot of that same kind of business still. There have been a lot of big civil cases that I have been involved in but I don't think one is more significant than the other.
ME: What types of work do you traditionally do before the court?
TC: Well that is hard to generalize. I have done a lot of Title Seven, a lot of constitutional law, but I also have done a lot of public's liability. I have done a few anti-trust cases. I've done a few patent cases, a few contract or commercial disputes of various stripes and as I think would be true of most practitioners in before the court that if you're not from one of these cities. The lawyers from East Texas are not specialists but we try lots of different kinds of cases.
ME: What judges have affected daily life and the community?
TC: Judge Justice probably more than the others because he was involved in school cases, prison cases and things of that sort and probably had more of an impact on citizens other than those who were the main parties in the lawsuits than any judges during the period of time that I have been practicing before the courts.
ME: What issues were the most important in the area?
TC: Well, I guess three things come to my mind are the school cases that Judge Justice was involved in, the prison cases and then the procedural activities or the administration of justice issues. Judge Justice was involved in the first two and Judge Parker was principally involved in the third. At the time I was not in favor of the things Judge Justice was doing in the prison and the schools. I am looking back on it now with 20/20 hindsight, have those kinds of positions or changes had not been required, we might have never moved, as a society, to the point where we are now. I might from a personal stand point, I might have disagreed with some individually things that have been done, but overall I think the progress that has been made is beneficial to our state and our area, society as a whole. I probably feel the same way about the prison cases. I am not sure I would agree with as many of the rulings in the prison cases as I might in the school cases. Nevertheless, I do not think anyone could argue that some of those things didn't need to take place. The changes, in regards to the procedures of the courts was something that I was involved in with Judge Parker and I was the Chairman of the first committee that dealt with those issues. We were one of the cutting edge districts in the country with regard to new and improved procedures.
ME: How has the law changed as a result of the United States District Court for the Eastern District of Texas?
TC: Well, I think in those same three areas. I think those three areas come to my mind as being the ones were the most significant changes in the law has occurred.
ME: In what direction do you think the court is moving?
TC: Well, I don't know if the court has a direction, I think it is a court as the present time that are very good lawyers. There are many of the judges who were really good litigators before they went on the bench and other had litigation experience. Boy, that makes such a difference to the trial practitioner to be dealing with a judge who knows what the trial lawyers is going through and what they are trying to get accomplished. My belief is that the judges are…You can always disagree with individual decisions but I think the judges are not as active as the court. I think they are giving people the opportunity to try the cases. I think they are following the law. I think they are giving all the people a fair trial. So don't have any problems with trials that I have been given by the judges involved. I don't perceive any inclination towards any issues or against any issue. It is simply doing the job that they have been appointed to do.
ME: Could you discuss the attorney-judicial relationship?
TC: To the best of my knowledge it is a very good collegial relationship. I don't know if the rest of the district do it or if we are unique but here is a bar association of Eastern District of Texas that we have an annual meeting with the court that very well attended and is very friendly and professional gathering where there is...
END OF INTERVIEW